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Author Topic: Kata Modifications?  (Read 1497 times)

Offline Paul Roberts

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Kata Modifications?
« on: February 07, 2003, 09:39:23 AM »
As far as I can remember, I've always been taught that there's a half-step between the two yokos in heian yondan. Just recently though I heard the suggestion that this had been a recent-ish introduction to help remedy sloppy kicking by us Western types (perhaps in the same way that Sensei Kawasoe sometimes teaches with an extra count for the kick-chambering position)...

Checking the JKA kata vidz, I see that the half-step is there... but of course there's no half-step in the equivalent sequence in Kanku Dai. Anybody have any views or history on this?
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Offline Moley

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« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2003, 07:03:25 PM »
Oss Paul,
Very interesting comment regarding the half step in Heian Yondan. This got me really thinking and so I decided to do some research on it. (Partly because I am very guilty and not only don't do it but don't teach it either! Oops sorry) You are absolutely right about it being in the J.K.A. video clips. I then went on to check the Best Karate series books by Nakayama Sensei (1979) and it's in that as well. So then I checked the Original JKA kata series as well as checking Kawasoe Sensei's videos. Yep it's there and very clearly so in Sensei's version. But I knew that I had seen it done without the half step and when I started training that's the way we were taught. (Mr Kato circa 1973 ? Mr Kato left Japan in 1967 ?? ) So after more research and delving into archive footage I finally found it : H Shoji in a b&w film. My wild guess is that is was filmed probably around 1959. This series of films also has Shirai Sensei and Kase Sensei performing kata.Although they are Japanese films they were released in Los Angeles. Can anybody date these films more accurately? Alun ? I got them as a present from you ! Years ago. Any more old timers out there not including the half step ? I know for a fact that Hooper Sempai teaches it !.
My only explanation is that the JKA introduced the half step following this period in order to follow enbusen and return to the starting point.
Interesting.

Feedback please !
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Offline Paul Roberts

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Kata Modifications?
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2003, 09:31:01 PM »
Cheers Moley - I figured you might have the resources to check this out!

The fact that the half-step is so widespread seems to discount the Westerner teaching aid theory - your embusen idea sounds much more likely. I'm sure I've read on Shotokan Planet that Nakayama tweaked some katas for this very reason...
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Offline gizmo

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« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2003, 09:57:25 PM »
When I first learnt heian yondan (around 1980) it was with the inclusion of the half step. I remember Kawasoe sensei teaching this kata about 10 years ago without the half step and I adopted this way for my own practice. The main reason is that the movement feels more natural. This was discussed at a further session with Kawasoe sensei about 2 or 3 years ago and he seemed to be happy with either approach. :?
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Offline Moley

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« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2003, 10:32:43 PM »
Actually, Since Paul (Scottish Paul or is he a Yorkie?) Posted about this half step, I've started teaching/including it again.
But to be really honest (I don't like it).
Yes it's easier to include the half step and Mole bach does it beautifully but I think I do it better without it.
TOP SECRET.
Once I tried to pin Sensei down to give me an actual straight answer on this. After many answers of "This one O.K. but this one also O.K. etc etc etc I asked him.
Now Sensei, tell me straight, no waffle, WHICH ONE DO YOU WANT US TO DO?

He answered laughing
Ahhhhh if I told you that, you would know as much as me !
 :wink:
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Offline Mole Bach

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« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2003, 12:41:58 AM »
Half step?

Gwyn/Gizmo,

If you recall, when we were first taught this, there was no half step, then Sensei came along and said "half step"  :o

When I talked to Sensei about it his words were
"If somebody can kick good, then no half step, BUT, if somebody, maybe older or maybe not so supple, then maybe half step OK".

That's why I include the half step.
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Offline Moley

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« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2003, 01:15:48 PM »
Quote from: Mole Bach
Half step?

When I talked to Sensei about it his words were
"If somebody can kick good, then no half step, BUT, if somebody, maybe older or maybe not so supple, then maybe half step OK".

That's why I include the half step.


That's why I don't include the half step.   :P  :P
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